Official SGT ADD thread

[GRUMPY PIRATE]

Well, if they give you a shot to numb the area first, they might as well give you one that doesn't hurt so much and makes you feel really mellow.

Could get the same effect with RUM!

[Princess Susi]

Good luck! Hope it doesn't hurt as much as you are expecting!

It did and then some... :(

Good luck Susi

Thanks! I WILL NOT go through that again! :mad:

Think happy thoughts like Raffles shoveling snow in his Disney attire.

He does have nice legs... ;)

break a leg Suz. OH wait that would be for auditions huh? Doesnt sound as good when someone is going for medical tests. Well if you did break a leg you would be in the right place. LOL Good luck

It would have been better if I HAD a broken leg. It would not have hurt so much! :(

Owie, but I believe they will numb it up first! Good Luck Susi, hope this one works well and you could walk at Disneyland this trip. :)

Oh, they numb you up all right, but THAT shot hurts like the power of 10,000 burning suns!!! (to steal a metaphor!)

I am sure that it will be okay, Good luck!!!

It was NOT okay, but I am NOW today 23 hours later....

My aunt gets the injections every few months, but they always sedate her first. That's the way to do it.
Hope the shot helps, susi. Let us know how it went, with all the gory details (I'm gonna have to get those shots one of these days).

So they give her a shot so they can give her a shot?

Well, if they give you a shot to numb the area first, they might as well give you one that doesn't hurt so much and makes you feel really mellow.

They HAVE to give you a shot of lidocaine to numb the area. They use such a huge needle to inject the steroid, because it so thick, it is not just a liquid like water, the medication has steroid crystals in it, in a more syrupy density. :twisted: It is hard to push through the needle, so they have to use a wide bore (big round hole at the end of the needle) so it goes in more easily! :twisted: SO.....You can imagine how much that would hurt. :( You would probably pass out from the pain of it, because of the crystals going in and the fact that that area is so sensitive and they are going very deep into a joint sac. Think that is a walk in the Park?

That is why they offer conscious sedation where they put a cath in your arm, (that does not hurt) and then they have two meds they inject through the catheter in the injection room. They use Fentanyl which is a newer opioid pain killer and Verced which is used as a relaxant to make you a little more calm amd sedated...

To be continued next post... I had 12,000 characters and it only allows for 5000...Long story!

[Princess Susi]

A little history...I already have had one steroid injection before this at Kaiser about a year ago and they do not use a sedating shot. They just go at you with their syringe and cutless needle with the lidocaine and then push the steroid after. I will tell you, that I SWORE I would NEVER, EVER, EVER have it done that way again. It hurt so bad for me. But you have to remember I also have an extremely low tolerance to pain.

It did hurt A LOT when they injected the lidocaine. When they put the Steroid in, you just feel pressure and then you feel a burning sensation down your leg (the sciatic nerve runs down your leg from the spine) and if it is done correctly you should feel the steroid go all the way down. The first injection at Kaiser, I felt it go down my buttock and then stop. (NO cracks hahaha, about my fat ass!!!!) That shot gave me relief for about 3 days and then the pain came back with a vengeance. The steroid did not go down my leg on the nerve far enough.

Back to yesterday...So they get the cath in, not an issue, those little needles (22 gauge bore) don't really hurt. It stings like a little bee at worst and I had a nurse who was so good, I did not even feel it go in and she got a flash of blood which told her she was in the vein, wrapped the cath so it would stay on my arm and off we went to the injection room.

She was also in charge of giving me the sedating drugs. The doc prepped the area (it has to be a very sterile procedure, because they are introducing a needle and meds into your spinal area and joint sac. ANYTHING foreign that gets in through the injection site can cause many problems, infection and worse! So, she injects the sedation and I wait. It should hit immediately because it is going intravenously, a direct route, straight into your blood... Well the doc reaches for the lido syringe and I say wait, the meds aren't working. I am still very alert. He said we have to do this now. So I figure it is just seconds before the meds take affect!

Nooooooooooo.... THEY NEVER TOOK AFFECT!!!! They may as well have injected me with normal saline, I felt no sedation at all. I was wide awake, just as I was for the Kaiser shot. I started to shake and get very panicky. There were 6 people in the room, all doing their various jobs, nurses, two docs and a radiologist because they use a radiograph screen to show them where to direct the needle, a VERY LONG, SHARP needle! So the doc injects the lido and I howl and he asks if I am going to be all right. I said, "I don't know, I thought I was going to be sedated,", he says "We have to have you awake." I told him I KNEW that, but I was supposed to be sedated enough that the procedure would not be AS painful as without. He said he did not know why I was not sedated. THE DRUGS WERE NOT WORKING ON ME, DUMBASS, YA THINK??????

So the really nice nurse asked if she could inject more sedation! HE said, guess what? He said NO!!!!!!! So I was really in a panic now. Wide awake, just like Kaiser and now we are about to get the big needle! I was FREEKING OUT!!!!! I am NOT good with needles, never have been, since I was a kid, they terrify me. This was why I chose this hospital to do the injection so I would be sedated and I wasn't. So he tells me I need to calm down or he is not going to finish, he will abort the whole procedure NOW, after he stuck me through with a cutlass or some shaper sword needle. I was shaking so bad and crying at that point, I said, "Let's just not do this. I want to leave now." They were quiet for a minute and he said, "We can do that, but we are halfway through this and the rest is not so bad." NOW, should I believe this guy who already denied me more sedation, because the first injections of it did not work? I thought it through for a minute and because we were already this far and I probably would never have the nerve to EVER, EVER do it again, I said "Let's just get this over with, KNOWING with the passion of 10,000 burning suns (Thanks again for a great metaphor!) already in my heart and mind, I would NEVER, EVER, EVER get another Steroid injection as long as I live. I could get though this one and then I would be done, even though my Spine Specialist wants me to have two more if this one does not work. :( :twisted: NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

[Princess Susi]

A note here: MY Spine Specialist and the guy who does the injections, not the same guy. These are specialists in injections that do this all day long. Earlier when we met just before the injection, He told me he had shots all day long to give and had done over 8000 of these. I trusted that he would get it right, I just did not know that I was going to have a bad experience again with no sedation.

So, we went ahead and he got that big ole needle and stuck it in my back. I could feel a LOT of pressure, but no real pain and then he injected something, and said it was dye to make sure he was getting it in the right place. I was watching the radiograph screen, so I could see everything. My search for knowledge in anything medical far outweighs my pain and fear. I actually should have been a neurologist. It is FASCINATING!!!!! Brain Surgery, my specialty...Mwahahahahahaha....
Besides, I would adminstering the pain, not recieving it!heeheehee (not really...) :twisted:

So when the dye went in I felt this incredible ache and pain in my leg all the way down to my toes. Oh, he had hit the right spot all right and he said, "Yes, we are in the right place, I am going to inject the steroid now." NO SHIT, SHERLOCK! Okay, the dye was enough, but when those steroid crystals in it's nice thick syrupy density went in, I FELT it. That HURT! And it made me gasp and cry some more. Then they were done. The whole time the nurses had been holding me down, since the damn sedation DID NOT WORK!!!!!!! And I was breathing as they told me...In through the nose, Out through the mouth, In through the nose, Out through the mouth. What was funny was that I was hyperventilating and they all were breathing with me, hahahahaha...the doc said "Are you breathing with her? You are going to pass out from hyperventilation." So they told me to breathe a little more slowly and not hyperventilate. Easy for them to say! It WAS actually kinda humourous! heeheehee. I had the nurses hyperventilating with me!!! :twisted:

So I got back to the exam room and the doc came in and we chatted while I trembled violently, and cried and he asked about the pain and he suggested a Pain Management Specialist. He also told me he would NEVER do another shot on me again, because he hates to hurt people and he could not put me through that again at his hands. Well, maybe if he had ordered MORE sedation, it would not have been like that. I asked him over and over why the sedation did not work and he said different people have different reactions to the sedation, blah, blah, blah.

I told him it had worked for me, years before when I had a broken arm that was crushed and they had to manipulate all the shards back into place, they used it and I was giddy! (I was NOT on any medications then. This was back in 1993)

BUT, he said probably due to the fact that I am on 60 mg of Morphine, six 325 mg Percocets and a couple other anxiety medications and that that dosage just did not affect me cause I am so used to the other meds and my med tolerance is high. So, you think they could have CHECKED that on my records before and how long I had been on this dose of meds and adjusted the sedation for a higher tolerance? Hmmmmmm? I think so. Or use a different cocktail of sedating drugs that are a bit more powerful for someone who has high tolerance to opiates already.

[Princess Susi]

Anyway, we came home and I was just in a state. I think I actually went through a mild post traumatic stress..I was shaking and crying and going over and over in my mind the pain from the shot and reliving that moment when he stuck that first needle in and I freaked out! The panicky fear I felt when I knew the sedating drugs had done nothing kept coming back and I could NOT stop shaking violently and crying so hard. I just kept going through it and I was shaking so hard for hours. That really was the strangest thing I have ever gone through from anything medical and I have had surgeries and all sorts of injuries that needed ER care, so it was weird that I was stressing still, hours later at home. Could be a mild Post trauma stress reaction, since I am deathly of needles and this procedure did not go well for me. I kept thinking that they lied and put normal saline in the syringe, instead of sedation drugs, that is how wigged out I was at home later. I kept thinking that they did not really care and just wanted to hurt me. I know, I know, irrational thoughts from a tweaked out, fear paralyzed mind! I am just so afraid of needles and pain.

Because of my low tolerance to pain, I cannot handle much. It hurts to brush my hair if I have lots of snarls and that is why I go through bottles of conditioner to make all the knots go away before I have to brush it out after washing it. When I first brush it in the morning, I grit my teth and do it. It can actually bring tears to my eyes if the knots are bad enough. That is how low a tolerance to pain, I have. Some people are like that. On the other end of the spectrum, are those who feel NO pain at all. They could put their hand in a bonfire and never feel it. Of course it could be fatally injurious to these people if they really got hurt and never felt it. I saw a special educational TV program on pain and they talked about the two ends of the spectrum and everywhere in between. Fascinating, the pain issue. It is soooooo different for everyone.

I feel so lame, because Ralph has extreme pain EVERY second of his life and he deals with it. He told me he has a very high tolerance to pain, because he has had it for 22 years and you learn to live with it, or, you don't. It makes me feel like a wimp and a baby and a complainer. I just can't take the pain like he does. And I wish I could. It makes me very sad. He IS inspirational, but that does not change the biochemistry of my low pain tolerance.

My back HURT too, when the lidocaine wore off and that was a bitch. I took one of my Percocet (which in effect, does nothing), but I wanted to be careful because I had been given the meds that morning, and you NEVER want to take more opiates so soon and make the level in your bloodstream too high. A dangerous thing to do, so I waited to take my Percocet, so I would not OD on opiates. I went to bed early, but could not sleep and took a couple more Percs because by that time the morphine had worn off and excreted and the meds from the morning were gone, and I was hurting. I also took a mild tranquilizer and it helped me sleep. :p:

A note: I HAD taken three of my .25 mg tranquilizers before the procedure as prescribed along with my two long acting Morphine, but the tranqs are so weak (that's why you take three, they are very, very low dosage), they only get rid of mild anxiety.

Anyway, it is today and though I am trembling just slightly still, my back does feel better. It hurt last night as usual with the sciatica running down my leg. My leg feels a little *odd*, can't really describe it, like a slight pressure from the steroid crystals in my nerve area. The real test will be later today. ALWAYS, in the late afternnon the pain comes and I can't walk by 3-4 PM. So, if the Steroid worked, I should not get the usual sciatica and weakness in my leg this afternoon. If it did not work, the pain will be visiting me. We shall see.

AND, that does NOT necessarily mean that it will work for LONG. The shot I had at Kaiser only lasted 3 days. As Ralph says, "I was hopping around like a 20 yr old for the first three days" and then the pain came back and never left until this morning. I have no pain in my leg and my lower back is stiff and sore, probably from the shot, BUT, my right side is hurting slightly and that is probably from the flattened lowest disk in my spine. This shot I got yesterday was injected in to a very tiny spot in my sacro iliac joint. The sacro iliac joint ids the one that connects your back (sacrum, which is the lowest part of the spine) to the ilium (which is the flat wing shaped flat bone on the inner side of the leg/hip.) So the spot they hit was on the left side where I have the most problems and it is a very specific, tiny target to hit. They hit it! He was good! Except he would not allow the nurse to give me more sedation. :mad:
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr..... :mad:

[Princess Susi]

So I will keep you posted about the pain or lack thereof! Do NOT let my story keep you from getting the injection if you need it. MOST folks will feel the sedation unless they are on heavy doese of opiates like I am. It is unfortunate that they did not adjust the dose for me. :(

I had two other steroid shots in my life last year besides the one in my back! One in my shoulder which was not bad. No lidocaine, but it was not needed. It was no worse than a flu shot which can hurt, but is tolerable for most people!

And the other was in my wrist, which they will NEVER touch again with a needle. That was more pain than I ever have to deal with, even post surgical pain. I was unable to move my hand for days and I was WRITHING in pain the first and second nights after injection. Truly writhing, unable to stop moving, because you try to get your mind off the excruciating pain that is taking over you entire body and mind! Because the wrist joint is even tinier and you are putting those crystals in there with that giant *pencil sized needle, not really pencil size, it just really feels that large!!! ) with that thick liquid it fills the joint sac and actually pushes it out like a bladder filling, BUT the difference is the jint sac is not made of smooth muscle that stretches. It is a menbrane that does NOT stretch as a rule. That pain was unbearable. If I had a had had a pistol, I would have havd put it in my mouth at that time. You get through it and then you are REALLY glad you did not have a pistol, but at the time you are so delirious with pain, nothing matters. You want it to STOP!
So that is my story of the Injection from Hell. I tell you I have a black cloud over me. I live Murphy's Law. Whatever can go wrong, will. It is always that way with me. Vacations from hell, problems with medical issues.

If it wasn't for bad luck, I wouldn't have any luck at all.

Just don't invite me to your house if you have expensive things! If you have a Ming Vase in a far corner, and I look at it from across the room, chances are it will fall all by itself, just from my gaze of doom. Really. ;)

So don't go by my tale of woe. I am a SUPER FREAK ;) about pain and needles and also take lots of drugs which kept the sedation from working. If you need the shot, try it. The other alternative is surgery and that will insure that you WILL have some sort of pain, from their cutting into your back, for the rest of your life. There is nothing to lose by trying the injections first and they may work. They don't for everyone and some have to have surgery, but you could be one who is like my brother who has had them and they worked. He has NOT had to have surgery.
Susi*YES, I am a wimp and big baby, I HATE needles and pain :( *slicker

Oh, yeah, forgot to tell ya...I was sweating bullets too. Really, really sweating. I sweat all the way through the procedure and all afternoon with the shaking and crying! Real attractive!

[vixen101485]

WOW! And here I was just going to post that the new Cheesecake Hershey Kisses are my new favorite food. I'll share with ya Suz. Feel special, I make Donnie perform for them (NO NOT in that way you sickos) Chocolate makes everything better ;)

[hobie16]

Wow!! After all that I really hope it works.

[Princess Susi]

Wow!! After all that I really hope it works.

You and me both! It was quite the experience. I cannot believe my reaction later in the day. That has NEVER happened to me before with anything that scares me or hurts or freaks me out. I just could not get myself under control for a while. Weird.

It BETTER work! It does not hurt now. It feels...well...normal..whatever that feels like..I have been in pain so long, it is hard to remember what no pain feels like. Good, that is what it feels like..really, really good. No pain. What a concept. ;)

Cute pic of Kurt in your avatar! ;)
And what kind of cookies does the Dark Side offer? Hmmmmmmm? Or is it just a trick to get everyone over to the Dark Side?

[GRUMPY PIRATE]

Wow, that sounds worse that getting a tattoo without the RUM!!!

I hope that the next time they do a bit more in controlling the pain for you. It would seem that the eaiser way is to do a bit more sedation before the procedure!!