Another one bites the dust

[PatchOBlack]

I jump to nothing, Look around tell me how many original attractions have been replaced or re-themed? A LOT OF THEM

Really? Not to my knowledge, but as you are making the accusation, please show your evidence. No, the burden of proof is yours, not ours, to look up and provide.

No one said you have to agree. But it's obvious you have no ides what's going on.

So, if I don't agree, I must have no idea what is going on. Sorry, no, that isn't how this works. In a proper debate, one must back up one's conclusions with verifiable facts. You don't get to just say "It's obvious".

Sorry, not my fault it's a lack-luster park

In your insulting opinion. Not fact, and put in a tactless manner. This sort of thing has no place in an intelligent discussion.

And yet you have not shown this. Walt was VERY disappointed in DL. he IMMEDIATELY started plans for another park.

Actually it was the other way around Walt saw the many, Many, MANY mistakes made with DL and decided it was best to fix them with another park.

Where does it say that? Aside from your own posts? What reliable sources can you site, that folks can verify this isn't just your own personal opinion? DisneyGuy85 at least gave a link to an outside source that seems to confirm that WDW was not suppose to be "Disneyland done right". You, on the other hand, just keep repeating your rather spurious claim that Walt was so disappointed with DL that he just had to make another park.

Your right it's all in how you use the space. I love the feeling of walking into a small department store that is so packed full of stuff you can not even push a cart around. But they used every bit of open floor space to display their products.

Your sarcasm is tiresome, but perhaps you just don't have any real valid arguments. You suggest that, because someplace is small, it must be cramped. This is not a given fact. With good planning, even a small store can provide more than ample space for both goods and customers.

You can think what you want. but I an not mad or yelling. If I were you would know. I am just standing by my opinion, like it or not. This is a discussion board and I am discussing my views on this matter.

So you keep claiming. Yet, based on your latest offerings, you seem to still be upset with Disney having the audacity of choosing to make changes at their parks without getting your approval, and such is your outrage that any suggestion that there is an alternative view must be met with hostility.

Thank God, 2 less that I have to listen to babble on and on about how anyone that thinks against the flow of the board is wrong and should be bashed.

They don't think the board is wrong, just that a certain poster has become not worth the trouble of dealing with any more.

I do not have to cite anything DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH. Stop only reading,watching, listening to the "rainbows and lollipops" of Disney. Look into the real stories. From the people that were there when it all happened, and I don't mean those books and videos that are marketed by Disney. Expand your minds a little.

No, YOU have to prove the facts of your own case. Stop implying that anyone who doesn't agree with your view is a know-nothing. You claim that there is proof? Let us know exactly where that proof lies, specifically. Otherwise, why should we believe you? So far, you haven't done much to earn a lot of trust or respect.

[Disneyguy85]

"Stop only reading,watching, listening to the "rainbows and lollipops" of Disney. Look into the real stories. From the people that were there when it all happened, and I don't mean those books and videos that are marketed by Disney. Expand your minds a little. "

Excuse me?

This page that I linked earlier is not run or associated by the Walt Disney Company whatsoever;

http://sites.google.com/site/theorigina ... da-project

Again;

"Walt Disney was not able to obtain funding and permission to start work on his Florida property until he agreed to build the Magic Kingdom first. Disney passed away before the Magic Kingdom opened and his vision of Epcot (the original project) was not realized"



"Walt Disney determined that Florida provided the ideal place to set up his new East Coast venue. But, Walt did not want to repeat himself by building another Disneyland. He wanted to create something entirely different: a community where people not just played in, but lived in as well. This was the beginning of EPCOT."

"Walt never wanted to make a "sequel" to Disneyland, always stating that there will always be one Disneyland. When Walt presented his ideas to the Board of Directors, they were skeptical. They wanted assurance that people would come to visit this "Disney World". What they wanted was a surefire hit: a Disneyland-style park.
Walt initially objected, but eventually relented, and he used the park to his advantage. He put the theme park in the northmost corner of the Florida property. Disney wanted everyone to experience the rest."

[ktulu]

I do not have to cite anything DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH. Stop only reading,watching, listening to the "rainbows and lollipops" of Disney. Look into the real stories. From the people that were there when it all happened, and I don't mean those books and videos that are marketed by Disney. Expand your minds a little.

Well, my research is all based on facts, so I'm not sure where I would need to go to find your special brand of research. I've been to both the DL and MK Fantasyland, all I found there were rides not "owned" or "themed" to either Cinderella or Sleeping Beauty. I did find rides with names of "ownership" like Snow White, Pinocchio, Peter Pan, Dumbo, Mr. Toad, Winnie the Pooh, Alice in Wonderland, Casey Jr. Circus Train, King Arthur Carrousel. I'm sure I'm forgetting someone...

[Honda Enoch]

And look how many original attractions are still there. These are just the ones that opened with the Magic Kingdom on October 1, 1971 or just a few days later and haven't changed significantly (Snow White, Enchanted Tiki Room, etc.) in all these years. A similar list could very easily be made for Disneyland.

Both of those you listed were changed, Tiki is not even close to the original any more. Disney had to do a movie tie in with it too.

The Walt Disney World Railroad, the Main Street Vehicles, Jungle Cruise, Swiss Family Tree House, Country Bear Jamboree, Peter Pan's Flight, it's a small world, Cinderella's Golden Carrousel attraction (has a new name but same attraction), Frontier Shooting Gallery, Hall of Presidents, Liberty Belle Riverboat (name and actual vessel has changed since opening), and the Haunted Mansion.

Guessing you have not been on the mansion in the past few years. It has changed as well.

But since you want to make list. lets list attractions that HAVE changed or vanished.


MAIN STREET
Main Street Cinema
Penny Arcade
Swan Boats
The Walt Disney Story

ADVENTURELAND
Tropical Serenade
Pirates and the Caribbean (another movie tie in)

FRONTIERLAND
Admiral Joe Fowler Riverboat
Davy Crockett's Explorer Canoes
Diamond Horseshoe Revue Show Formats
Mike Fink Keel Boats

LIBERTY SQUARE
The Haunted Mansion

FANTASYLAND
20,000 Leagues Under the Sea
Dumbo, The Flying Elephant: Original Ride
Legend of the Lion King
Magic Journeys
Mickey Mouse Revue
Mr. Toad's Wild Ride
Skyway to Tomorrowland
Snow White's Scary Adventures: Original Ride

TOMORROWLAND
Carousel of Progress: The Best Time of Your Life
Circle-Vision 360 Films (America the Beautiful, Magic Carpet 'Round the World, American Journeys)
Flight to the Moon/Mission to Mars
Grand Prix Raceway / Tomorrowland Speedway
If You Had Wings/If You Could Fly
Skyway to Fantasyland
Star Jets
Timekeeper
WEDway PeopleMover


And that's just the MK, I can list EPCOT too if you want?

LACKLUSTER?!?! Disneyland is by no means "lackluster"! I recommend you visit there before spouting off any more disparaging remarks about the original Disney park!

Your right. I am sorry. lackluster was the wrong word. I'll stick with small and cramped

When you state something as a fact it is YOUR responsibility to cite sources. Others have cited sources and have backed up with proof their statements but you can't or won't do so. That makes everything you say suspect.

When you read or hear something it is YOUR responsibility to do research on it.

[ktulu]

When you read or hear something it is YOUR responsibility to do research on it.

I just completed my research on everything you said, and it was all wrong. I'd cite it all for you, but you said I don't have to do that. I also learned during my research that your mom was only 1/2 troll on her father's side, but your dad was 100% troll. Again, no citation needed...

[Shorty82]

Both of those you listed were changed, Tiki is not even close to the original any more. Disney had to do a movie tie in with it too.

That's what I said. I was citing examples of opening day attractions that have changed

Guessing you have not been on the mansion in the past few years. It has changed as well.

You're right, I forgot.

But since you want to make list. lets list attractions that HAVE changed or vanished.

{REDACTED}

You said original attractions (here).My list was all the original attractions still there and basically the same, your list was most every attraction ever removed or changed.

Your right. I am sorry. lackluster was the wrong word. I'll stick with small and cramped

When are you going to get it through your thick skull Disneyland is NOT cramped?! It is smaller, yes, but not cramped. Again, visit there so you have first-hand experience before making anymore disparaging remarks on its size.

When you read or hear something it is YOUR responsibility to do research on it.

Wrong. Try that on a research paper and the teacher will fail you. It is the responsibility of the person stating facts to back those facts up.

[Honda Enoch]

I just completed my research on everything you said, and it was all wrong. I'd cite it all for you, but you said I don't have to do that.

I am sure that you have read EVERY book ever written and watched EVERY video ever made about Disney. You are now the MASTER DISNEY GURU.

I also learned during my research that your mom was only 1/2 troll on her father's side, but your dad was 100% troll. Again, no citation needed...

Not sure why I even took you off my ignore list.

Back you go.


BTW Admin, I thought that personal attacks were TOS violation here?

TYou said original attractions (here).My list was all the original attractions still there and basically the same, your list was most every attraction ever removed or changed.

ALL of them are original attractions.

When are you going to get it through your thick skull Disneyland is NOT cramped?! It is smaller, yes, but not cramped. Again, visit there so you have first-hand experience before making anymore disparaging remarks on its size.

I do not need to visit (My Claustrophobia would kill me) anyone can look at a map (or Google earth) and see how cramped it is.

Wrong. Try that on a research paper and the teacher will fail you. It is the responsibility of the person stating facts to back those facts up.

Um, that's the point of a research paper. the student hers about a topic then goes and does their own research to get the details and facts.








Anyway I have said my thoughts I have posted FACTS many times in this thread and you all want to ignore them and change the direction. So have fun. say and think what you want. The facts still remain that Disney is slowly destroying the parks we all grew up with replacing them with a bunch of movie tie in crap. One going to Disney parks gets nothing more then an expensive trip to a Six Flags park.

[Honda Enoch]

TYou said original attractions (here).My list was all the original attractions still there and basically the same, your list was most every attraction ever removed or changed.

ALL of them are original attractions.

When are you going to get it through your thick skull Disneyland is NOT cramped?! It is smaller, yes, but not cramped. Again, visit there so you have first-hand experience before making anymore disparaging remarks on its size.

I do not need to visit (My Claustrophobia would kill me) anyone can look at a map (or Google earth) and see how cramped it is.

Wrong. Try that on a research paper and the teacher will fail you. It is the responsibility of the person stating facts to back those facts up.

Um, that's the point of a research paper. the student hers about a topic then goes and does their own research to get the details and facts.

[Shorty82]

Here is a list of opening day Disneyland attractions that are still there. I didn't remove the ones that have changed since opening day.

Horse-drawn Street Cars
Main Street Cinema
Disneyland Railroad (not original name)
Storybook Land Canal Boats (not original name)
Casey Jr. Circus Train
Dumbo Flying Elephants
King Arthur Carrousel
Mad Tea Party
Peter Pan's Flight
Snow White's Adventures
Autopia
Mark Twain Riverboat
Jungle Cruise

From here

[Mayonnaise]

Keep up with the program now Shorty... the High Prince Honda only recognizes the legitimacy of WDW. He has no use for a list of attractions not yet changed at the "cramped" and "lackluster" DL.

8^P