SG or just plain Cruel

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Randy B
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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Randy B » Sat Sep 08, 2007 10:42 pm

susislicker wrote:GOTTA LOVE ALL CRITTERS!!!
I agree with you. I am not a radical but I do have a very soft spot for almost all critters (mosquitos and some of their ilk, and deliberately cruel SGs are the main exceptions). To show how far I will go, I once had an apartment where I was frequently woken by a gnawing/chewing noise coming from the direction of the kitchen. I finally tracked it down to the cabinet under the sink where I stored various cleaning supplies (it was an efficiency apt). I finally narrowed the search to the vacuum cleaner hose. I put on leather gloves and covered both ends of the hose and lifted. The chewing stopped. :) I grabbed a clean glass jar with a metal lid, poked holes in the lid and emptied the critter from the hose to the jar. I had a cute little grey mouse. I spent the next day gathering lots of mouse toys and a good aquarium. I kept the mouse as a pampered pet for many years. Durring those years I also collected several more mice. At one time I had 17 mice in an enclosure that covered a card table to a height of 3-4 ft. Definately much prefferable IMHO to kill traps.

BTW I found that by the second generation the mice would allow me to handle them with bare hands with no danger. But I couldn't trust them out of confinement. But by the third generation I could carry them around with me with no problems. It's fun to see reactions of people when I was playing Putt Putt with a little grey mouse perched on my hat or climbing down into a nest container in my shirt pocket. :D:

Randy

PS Don't get me started on the cute cuddly flying mammals that many people fear. LOVE 'em



Big Wallaby
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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Big Wallaby » Sun Sep 09, 2007 1:39 am

Randy B wrote:PS Don't get me started on the cute cuddly flying mammals that many people fear. LOVE 'em
But... but... I want to hear ALL about bats!


My opinions are mine and mine only. If my opinions are the opinion of others who happen to share whatever my crazy views may be, then fine, but it's not because I represent them in having my opinions. Got it?

Randy B
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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Randy B » Sun Sep 09, 2007 2:33 am

Big Wallaby wrote:But... but... I want to hear ALL about bats!
I'll save that until we spend one of your days off wandering the parks next month. The lecture...err discussion can go on for hours and hours. :bat:

Randy



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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Cheshire Figment » Sun Sep 09, 2007 7:03 am

Is having bats in one's bus similar to having bats in one's belfrey?



Princess Susi
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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Princess Susi » Sun Sep 09, 2007 11:55 am

Randy B wrote:I agree with you. I am not a radical but I do have a very soft spot for almost all critters (mosquitos and some of their ilk, and deliberately cruel SGs are the main exceptions). To show how far I will go, I once had an apartment where I was frequently woken by a gnawing/chewing noise coming from the direction of the kitchen. I finally tracked it down to the cabinet under the sink where I stored various cleaning supplies (it was an efficiency apt). I finally narrowed the search to the vacuum cleaner hose. I put on leather gloves and covered both ends of the hose and lifted. The chewing stopped. :) I grabbed a clean glass jar with a metal lid, poked holes in the lid and emptied the critter from the hose to the jar. I had a cute little grey mouse. I spent the next day gathering lots of mouse toys and a good aquarium. I kept the mouse as a pampered pet for many years. Durring those years I also collected several more mice. At one time I had 17 mice in an enclosure that covered a card table to a height of 3-4 ft. Definately much prefferable IMHO to kill traps.

BTW I found that by the second generation the mice would allow me to handle them with bare hands with no danger. But I couldn't trust them out of confinement. But by the third generation I could carry them around with me with no problems. It's fun to see reactions of people when I was playing Putt Putt with a little grey mouse perched on my hat or climbing down into a nest container in my shirt pocket. :D:

Randy

PS Don't get me started on the cute cuddly flying mammals that many people fear. LOVE 'em

OFF TOPIC...a bit...

OMG, I LOVE YOU! BATS! YAY! I will catch any little critter, crickeys have recently taken over our house and we try to escort them out before our nasty cat, Tinkerbell munches them. Skeeters, I try to avoid, but may have to smash if they try to suck my blood, I need it. But pretty much all living things get respect from me, oh, except those big ugly potato bugs that live in California, if you have never seen one, go do a yahoo search for Potato Bug or Jerusalem Cricket! GROSS! They are prehistoric scary and my cats always used to drag them in and play with them. You could hear an unearthly scream coming from my house when we found one, or was that when Darph stumbled in drunk, lost again...sorry Darph, could not resist.
I have an almost zen feel for critters, I was born to love animals, BUT:
As a Veterinarian friend of mine once said, "You can love your animals, just don't LOOOOOVVVE your animals..." I respectfully (for the animals sake) must agree.
Back to topic sorry...
Michael Vick and his ilk should be made to sit in their cages in prison and have the guards "Release the Hounds!" into the cage with them. Make those hounds the ones he trained. Not only did he and his cohorts murder dogs, but had others murdered by the authorities because of what they trained them to do. All those poor dogs never had a chance because of the training. Disgusts me. I did ride alongs with our Animal Patrol. The shelter I worked at is a foundation run shelter called Dumb Friends League in Denver, highly respected. They have their own officers to check on offenses and calls for help for animals. I went with a few times and MAN! What the hell are people thinking? :confused: It was Summer and the idiots had dogs tied up outside to stakes with no water or food available and NO shelter from the heat; Over and over, we saw case after case. In the Winter it gets very cold in Denver and we found the same thing. Winter is brutal on animals' paws and skin because it freezes and I cannot understand the ignorance of the morons who have these pets. Why even have a dog if you are not going to care for it or don't want to provide the simplest neccessities for them? I just cannot fathom what makes people think this way about another life. I guess they are NOT thinking.
Last year, all the cattle on the eastern plains of Colorado were in serious trouble due to blizzard after blizzard that roared through our state. I think there were 100,000 head that were stranded out in the plains because of the blizzards. we had a campaign started by a local radio station to call PETA to help donate $$ to do Hay drops to them and they refused on the grounds that these cattle would only end up dead anyway, slaughtered by the rancher. So it was better for them to starve and dehydrate to death in the blizzard according to PETA! :mad: The Air National Guard took helicopters and hay out and did hundreds of drops, but PETA would not part with $10,000 of their estimated 12 million in funds to help. I have little respect for PETA when two members of PETA were caught euthanizing dogs and cats in the back of a van and then throwing the bodies into dumpsters. :eek: This is fact, the bodies were retrieved , these PETA workers now face serious charges of animal cruelty. So much for PETA loving animals, they love press, they love attention, but they will not lift a finger to help animals who REALLY are in dire situations. They "release" captured lab animals simply to get media attention! What happens to these creatures who were raised in lab situations and cannot fend for themselves in the wild? There is much controversy over lab animals. I have been in several facilities that made me gag and cry and I left. These were choices for me to do my internship there! NEVER! Then there are labs that I have seen treat the animals with the utmost respect. All of these labs hire Veterinary Technicians to care for the animals, who get exceptionally humane treatment from the Techs (most Techs become Techs because of their love for animals!) and these studies are "generally humane", and I say, "generally" because all labs are different, but most will euthanize the creatures very kindly and quickly. There are some that are barbaric and you do not want me to tell you how it is done. I have had the displeasure of seeing euthanasia on many different types of animals and they all differ in the quickest, most humane way to do it. As a tech, I have had to be involved in some. I have also walked out on some they wanted me to help with because I felt they were not warranted, a healthy animal that maybe had been in the shelter a couple months without being adopted to make room for another animal. I could not do that! I still am on the fence about animal testing for medical issues. For cosmetics and other things, this should not be done.
As you can tell, I have found my passion in life! I will adore creatures and do for them what I can for the rest of my life. We donate generously to animal causes, NOT PETA, but the local shelters like Dumb Friends League where we can see our money at work.

**** :( On a sad note, we have a beautiful 11 year old kitty named Orion we rescued as a tiny little waif of a kitten. He has had issues all his life and he was fortunate that we found him because we are blessed financially to be able to afford his medical bills. He has diabetes and we have treated him with insulin shots twice daily for 7 yrs now. In March of this year he was diagnosed with Mastocytoma, cancer of the Spleen and liver and given 2-3 months. We cancelled our May month long trip to WDW to be here. I would have never forgiven myself if he had died while we were in Florida. Amazingly, this cat is still with us! :D: He is tough! A fighter! He goes in for drainings of the abdominal fluid every two weeks and he gets whatever he wants, treats, cream, the best food, hugs and kisses...we love him so much and he loves us right back. My hubby, Ralph has always referred to Orion as his son. Ralph never had pets growing up and I brought them into his life and he adores them. He will be devastated because he has NEVER been through this before, I have. I have had animals all my life and worked with them so I know what is to come. It does not make it any easier, especially since this is our baby. He has gotten so thin and we know it is just a matter of time! It is going to a very rough time in our house and we will need to get away. We have not been able to go anywhere, even for just a weekend, because of all the meds we have to give Orion and my cat, Tawny who has thyroid issues. It is an all day affair. We will go somewhere to deal with our grief and just to have some quiet time when it is all over. And I know even then, it won't be over. Orion will stay in our hearts forever, especially Ralph's as this is his very first catfriend. I will be there to help him through his grief. And we have the three other pussycats to remind us they need care still and the birds screaming at us all day!

I need all of you here to pray for Orion, he is such a wonderful little being. I will try to post a pic here, I am not so tech savvy, but hubby did load the pics on the computer, now I just have to figure out how to get them onto a thread.
Orion says MEOW! and is pissed about animal cruelty too! Although he thinks beating up his brothers and sisters is not cruel! LOL We have 4 cats, Orion Supacat :supercat: , Tawny :kitty: , Oliver :cat2: and Tinkerbell! :cat1: and two nasty loud Parrots! :parrot2: :parrot: We love our animals, but we do NOT LLLOOOVVVE our animals... and they appreciate that! HAHAHAHA!
Once again sorry for the long diatribe, I just had a lot to say and needed to get it out!

Susi and all her critters! that includes the big critter, hubby, Ralph! :D: Pray for Orion! =^.^=


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Big Wallaby
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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Big Wallaby » Sun Sep 09, 2007 12:11 pm

susislicker wrote:"You can love your animals, just don't LOOOOOVVVE your animals..." I respectfully (for the animals sake) must agree.
Uh, I am really hoping that's not just for the animals' sake...

I'm sorry you guys have to go through that. Reminds me of my beautiful white cat, Sam, who was born with leukemia. That was a really, really hard one on me. The day we found out was the day he died, because we didn't know about it until he was so sick that he couldn't move. Horrible day. Then there was Hanah, who my family picked up at a church camp. In the mornings, she would take the same route home from her nightly wanderings, and she would be loudly meowing the whole way. One day, she didn't come back, and with the fact that my mom heard what sounded like a gunshot the previous afternoon, our working theory is that someone shot her. :( No clue as to whom, or I'd have loved to string him up by his nuts.


My opinions are mine and mine only. If my opinions are the opinion of others who happen to share whatever my crazy views may be, then fine, but it's not because I represent them in having my opinions. Got it?

Princess Susi
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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Princess Susi » Sun Sep 09, 2007 12:21 pm

Big Wallaby wrote:Uh, I am really hoping that's not just for the animals' sake...

I'm sorry you guys have to go through that. Reminds me of my beautiful white cat, Sam, who was born with leukemia. That was a really, really hard one on me. The day we found out was the day he died, because we didn't know about it until he was so sick that he couldn't move. Horrible day. Then there was Hanah, who my family picked up at a church camp. In the mornings, she would take the same route home from her nightly wanderings, and she would be loudly meowing the whole way. One day, she didn't come back, and with the fact that my mom heard what sounded like a gunshot the previous afternoon, our working theory is that someone shot her. :( No clue as to whom, or I'd have loved to string him up by his nuts.
Uh, no it is for everyone's sake, my mistake in not clarifying that...
I am so sorry for your loss of your beautiful pets. It is so hard to lose them. They REALLY are members of the family, aren't they?
And I would be right there to help you string the b**tard by his cojones, gladly! That upsets me so much.


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Big Wallaby
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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Big Wallaby » Sun Sep 09, 2007 1:12 pm

Yep, they do become members of the family. Hannah was such a funny little thing... It's amazing how cats have a VERY distinctive personality from each other. Dogs do too, but not on the same level.

What you were saying about PETA doesn't surprise me at all. Sadly, many groups that could do something in the world are either 1) Screwed up, or 2) in it for the wrong reasons, or both. I still have to scratch my head at how a death by starvation is better than a (hopefully) quick slaughter.

I am not against using animals, or even hunting, but make sure that you do it with a respect for the life you are hunting. If you don't understand that statement, you don't belong out hunting. There is nothing better tasting to me than a salmon that I went out, caught, killed, took home and cooked. However, I am not a fan at all of Oregon/Washington's catch and release program, because it turns the caught and released salmon into a useless fish. The fish exerts an incredible amount of power and energy trying to escape, and it's doing this on an empty stomach. That fish hasn't eaten in about eighty miles by the time it reaches Portland and Vancouver. When you release that fish into the water, it's spent, it's injured, and it will never reach its spawning ground to mate. So with the catch limits, I would rather see the fishermen take whatever the first two fish they catch are, and not injure a fish with the catch and release program. While I've never gone hunting, I have no problem with the people who do it, again, as long as they are respectful of the animals they are after and the ones they are not.


My opinions are mine and mine only. If my opinions are the opinion of others who happen to share whatever my crazy views may be, then fine, but it's not because I represent them in having my opinions. Got it?

Princess Susi
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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Princess Susi » Sun Sep 09, 2007 1:56 pm

I agree with you Big Wall. Are you familiar with Ted Nugent's take on hunting? I never could hunt myself, just could not do it, bit I do understand it and if the people use the whole animal and treat it with respect I see nothing wrong with it. I have enjoyed fishing, even cleaning the suckers after wards. I know I am strange. I did not know that about the catch and release, very interesting point. But trophy hunting? That is disgusting! They set up these safaries and hunting trips to bring home the head or the giant fish so some fool can stuff it and hang it on his/her wall, and that is repulsive to me. That fool can stuff it, all right!
Ted Nugent has a very good attitude towards hunting and when he takes people out, the meat is donated to soup kitchens all over. They have fed millions of hungry and homeless folks with the meat from the hunting trips that Ted has taken people out on. He believes in respect of the earth and it's resources. Much like the Indians, although they don't sing Cat Scratch Fever like the wild man! ;)


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Shorty82
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Re: SG or just plain Cruel

Post by Shorty82 » Sun Sep 09, 2007 2:13 pm

Even tough I don't hunt I see nothing wrong with hunting, as long as the hunter uses at least most of the animal. Eat, sell, and/or give away the meat at least and if possible do something with the skin.

People who kill for sport are sick IMO. It is one thing to kill for food and all but to kill just for the thrill of it? I don't get that.


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and curiosity keeps leading us down new paths.

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Keep moving forward

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