Stupid Guest Tricks

Kwahati wrote:Ohh! That's a good idea for an attraction suitable for most guests! Come visit Mickey's Magical Short Bus Ride! (The only attraction in the World where the FP's always have an immediate return time!) *BYOH: Bring Your Own Helmet!

Awesome! It could also be the only attraction that loads in the park and unloads outside, possibly at a random location in South LA!

BRWombat wrote:Awesome! It could also be the only attraction that loads in the park and unloads outside, possibly at a random location in South LA!

:hysteria: :hysteria: :hysteria: :hysteria: :hysteria: :hysteria: :hysteria: Still laughing.
Can we get one in Orlando, too??

Morticia wrote:Actually my response was somewhat tongue in cheek. The bit I'm sure about is that you should be able to confiscate FPs of people who block the entry to the FP return line. That way, the average moron would only make the mistake a couple of times before learning to wait somewhere else until the correct time to return.

Psstt..I was just going along with you. :D

I was at DL this Sunday, and I got a fast pass for Splash Mountain. Well, I returned around 4 hours after the cut-off time, and although I've read that it doesn't matter, the CM kind of gave me a hard time about it. Made me feel bad. I tried to laugh it off, but he kept harping on it. But he did let us pass though. Does it really bother you CMs if guests return after the allotted time period? Because the last thing I want to do is make your day more irritable, especially in this heat.

writerevie wrote:I was at DL this Sunday, and I got a fast pass for Splash Mountain. Well, I returned around 4 hours after the cut-off time, and although I've read that it doesn't matter, the CM kind of gave me a hard time about it. Made me feel bad. I tried to laugh it off, but he kept harping on it. But he did let us pass though. Does it really bother you CMs if guests return after the allotted time period? Because the last thing I want to do is make your day more irritable, especially in this heat.

If a large number of guests were to come way later (like 4 hours or more) after the cut off time, it is not fair to the other Fast Pass guests who have returned in the allotted time frame. Even worse, it can send the Standby que time through the roof making for a tense time with those guests who do not have FP :mad:

We attempt to educate guests on Fast Pass and how it works while the guest is at Distrubution There is only one time that we do not hesitate to accept really late FP's, and that is when the attraction was shut down for either weather or technical reasons.

Hope this helps.... :D:

Yeti Chaser wrote:If a large number of guests were to come way later (like 4 hours or more) after the cut off time, it is not fair to the other Fast Pass guests who have returned in the allotted time frame

That doesn't make sense to me. Since a spot is saved in a virtual queue, if someone does not show up, their spot is still saved, just pushed aside. The system does not know that they didn't show, therefore continues distributing normally. Thus, once their entry time passes, they should be able to enter whenever. Another example: Think of it as a person waiting in the virtual queue, and then just before getting on the ride, they constantley let everyone go ahead. The only problem that could occur is if all of these people who were late showed up at once, but statistically, since people generally don't care once they are late how late they are, this should not occur except in the instance of a large show letting out. (ex: Fantasmic!, parades) Sorry, that was the inner engineer!

I have to agree with Kurtis here....I don't care how late they show up, although I was myself given a bit of a hard time once in WDW..the guy muttered something aobut can't you read a clock...but this was before we were given tickets as DL CMs so the FP machines were not reading our IDs and the CM in distribution had handed us these FPs out of his pocket, extras that he already had I guess and they were old enough that the time was already past, that's what really irritated me about it, I was tempted to go complain about the guy because of the inconsistency (sp?), one CM gave us past FP and the other one is upset with us for using one. Okay enough babbling

kurtisnelson wrote:That doesn't make sense to me. Since a spot is saved in a virtual queue, if someone does not show up, their spot is still saved, just pushed aside. The system does not know that they didn't show, therefore continues distributing normally...

Okay, let's think about this -- having arrived late for FPs myself, I've always been curious whether it makes a difference or not. I'll try to dust off memories of the queue simulations I did for a statistics class in college!

Pulling numbers out of the air, let's say a ride has a capacity of 1000 guests per hour, and it is in demand and operating at capacity. 1000 guests are going to ride each hour, whether they are Fastpass or standby. Let's further say the system gives out 500 FPs for each hour, so that if everyone uses the FP and returns during their allotted hour, half of the riding guests will come from the FP queue, and half will come from the standby queue. So a normal period of time would look like this:
12p-1p SB: 500 FP: 500
1p-2p SB: 500 FP: 500
2p-3p SB: 500 FP: 500
3p-4p SB: 500 FP: 500
4p-5p SB: 500 FP: 500

Okay so far? Well, what if, say, 200 guests with a 12p-1p return time do not show? Only 300 guests come through the FP queue, but the attraction still has a 1000 guest/hr capacity, so the additional 200 guests would likely be drawn from the standby queue. In other words, the SB queue would move faster during any hour where FP returns are less than expected.

So, then, what if all 200 of those FPs show up at the 3p-4p hour, along with the FP guests actually slated for that time slot? You'd have 700 FPs instead of 500. The effect this would have on the individual queues would depend on the CM at merge. If the ratio is kept at 50/50, then the standby queue would keep flowing as normal, but the Fastpass guests would be in for a longer wait. More likely, the merge CM would increase the ratio of FP guests to SB guests so that all 700 FPs can ride, and the number of SB guests would be reduced, increasing their wait. Our chart would then look like this:
12p-1p SB: 700 FP: 300
1p-2p SB: 500 FP: 500
2p-3p SB: 500 FP: 500
3p-4p SB: 300 FP: 700
4p-5p SB: 500 FP: 500

So... it looks like exactly what you'd expect: the standby line will move faster when fewer FPs show up, and it will move slower when more than expected show up (and may to some extent affect the FP queue the same way, depending on the merge ratio -- plus a late-arriving 3p-4p FP guest would find himself behind 700 people instead of the expected 500).

True, the net result to the entire system is neutral, and the attraction still hosts 1000 guests per hour either way. But there would be a definite effect on individual queues (and guests) as the flow of FP returns varies. The guests in line when you don't show up benefit from your absence, and the guests in line when you do show up pay the price.

Personally, I'm all for the current policy, as long as it's not abused. Sometimes it's hard to time your return, and I appreciate having the extra leeway in case we don't make it back before the end time. BUT I don't think it's correct to say that there is no effect.

BRWombat wrote:Okay, let's think about this -- having arrived late for FPs myself, I've always been curious whether it makes a difference or not. I'll try to dust off memories of the queue simulations I did for a statistics class in college!

Ok, without quoting your entire post....your reasoning is sound, except that first of all there aren't quite that many FPs given out for a ride with that capacity (or at least I don't think so I've never really figured out how many go out in an hour) and the reason why late FPs make no discernible difference is that the vast majority of the time people return within their window and those that don't are rarely if ever all going to come back within the same late window. At least that's been my experience working with FP.

lady ulrike wrote:and the reason why late FPs make no discernible difference is that the vast majority of the time people return within their window and those that don't are rarely if ever all going to come back within the same late window. At least that's been my experience working with FP.

That is what I was trying to say

kurtisnelson wrote:The only problem that could occur is if all of these people who were late showed up at once, but statistically, since people generally don't care once they are late how late they are, this should not occur except in the instance of a large show letting out.