I'd like a kids meal for my....er, I thought you had him dear.

[Zazu]

It has nagged at me ever since I read it and I just have to say, I just don't think the joke about abducted children being put to work in IASW is in any way funny.

Perhaps it wasn't the right place for that joke. I'm now sorry I put it in there, but at the time I was just trying to lighten the mood.

Secondly, how does someone who is not in law enforcement confirm for a certainty, really, that there has never been an abduction from WDW?

Several of us went to law enforcement and asked to see the records, others checked local newspaper files.

Can you say the same about assaults on children, by fellow guests or otherwise?

No. Kids and adults get assaulted at WDW every day. There have been times when I wanted to intervene, but didn't have a baseball bat handy. That said, most assaults are by family members.

I am not meaning to pick a fight with anyone...

... and I'm not taking it that way...

... but I got to thinking about it and I just wonder how you could really be sure that there aren't sealed court documents or something somewhere.

Court documents can be sealed. It takes a *very* unusual situation to also purge the arrest records and the newspapers, both of which we searched. (Wombat, do you have an opinion about sealed records like this?)

I've seen too much in my life, I guess, to think that if you called up Orange County or the FBI that they'd be that forthcoming.

Then you will have to remain unconvinced. Those are the best sources I know of. If you ever do find evidence of an abduction, please let us all know.

Do they volunteer that info about any crimes from purse snatching or what have you that happen on property? Nope! Because there is an image to uphold!

Contrary to popular belief, the FBI and County Sheriff don't work for Mickey. The Orlando Sentinel *surely* isn't going to defend the Mouse after the events of the past few years.

I'm sorry, everybody, but this whole topic really got me down and thinking back again over what happened to me when I was a kid has made it important to me to get the thread back to the topic of kids getting lost and why people need to be sure they know where their kids are at all times.

I think we're in agreement on this. Kids go wandering off from oblivious parents every day -- inside WDW and out -- and some come to harm. This is one of the reasons I'm always happy to see a toddler on a leash, as that's one less kid I have to worry about.

If I've worn out my SGT welcome with these posts and by asking the above questions, I apologize and I'll go quietly. But this is a topic too close to my own heart to just sit and stew about it. It's not good for my health.

No problem here. You raise valid points and ask reasonable questions.

I don't doubt that the question was asked. I just doubt there is even an obligation on the part of law enforcement to be forthcoming with the truth.

One agency, possibly. But two different agencies, plus the local newspaper? It would seem to require a pretty big conspiracy to keep all of them quiet, even if there were only one such incident.

But that takes nothing away from your advice that parents need to keep careful watch over their children.

[GRUMPY PIRATE]

You know, I hate to be a downer and I know that this thread has taken a lighthearted upswing again but I just had to say a couple more things before I bow out of it.
I don't doubt that the question was asked. I just doubt there is even an obligation on the part of law enforcement to be forthcoming with the truth.

...REDACTED

Bru

I can answer with more than a passing knowledge, that any questions to law enforcement along those lines will not be answered, except with a "no comment" or "that information is unavailable" The reason is NOT a coverup, as many people will jump to that conclusion.

The reasons are many. First, the information is consider 'sensitive" in that by just saying if an incident took place, on a date and time, could possibly identify a victim. Something that is absoutely not going to be done. The right to privacy of the victim is the highest priority. So much so, that great lengths, in some cases, have been taken to guard their identity.

Second, Law enforcement does NOT want the bad guy to know what they know. Many times the suspect will hope that the victim will not tell, so they will watch the news to see if it was reported. If they think that it hasn't been, they just might get taken by suprise or try and commit another crime, often while being watched. They also do not want detailes of the crime out to the general public, as some times someone will come forward and "confess" to a crime that they did not commit. This can cause all kinds of problems in putting the case together on the real suspect. By keeping details confidential, the investigtor can actually eliminate suspects from the investigation.

Third, some of the criminals get a second thrill by reading about the crime or watch a news report about it. It helps them re-live the moment.

Also, once information is received by law enforcement and placed in the "system" (paper or electronic form) there are a large number of laws, federal, state and local, that make it illegal to disclose to anyone, other than law enforcement, without special permissions being given.

Thats why you always see a suspects lawyer making statements to the press extolling why his client is as pure as the driven snow, and law enforcement cannot comment.

I hope that answere some of your questions.

[February]

Thank you to both of you for your replies, gentlemen. I do appreciate all the info.

Taking a break for a little bit. See you all 'real soon'. . .

Bru

[Tara_Lee3]

so......

...anyone who works at DL...

Is there or has there ever been such a train warning sign?

Or were my parents just coming up with another of their 'big ones' ?

[mechurchlady]

you are talk 1970's or 1980's. Sounds like Knott's Berry Farm. DLR trains run on the outside of the park except for the 3 bridges, 2 at main street station and one at toon town. Trying to think of when there might have been a train crossing. enjoy the memories and your loving parents.

[GRUMPY PIRATE]

so......

...anyone who works at DL...

Is there or has there ever been such a train warning sign?

Or were my parents just coming up with another of their 'big ones' ?

Could have been a little of both!!! I remember walking under the tracks at WDW?

but The train just circles good 'ol Disneyland! perhaps you also went to knotts. I remember taking the ride there, and we had to cross the tracks to get to a western town area, and later we crossed them again to get to another ride. but that was LONG ago, as I havn't been to knotts since 1993!!

(finally just gave up other parks and went with Disney all the time!!)

[felinefan]

The western town area you refer to is Ghost Town, the original part of the park. One-fourth of the old buildings are genuine, and came from the town of Calico, in San Bernardino County near Barstow. The train, the Calico Railroad, is a genuine 1881 Baldwin Consolidation C-19 2-8-0 narrow gauge train, originally from the Denver and Rio Grande Railroad in Colorado. It doesn't exactly go around the whole park, but it originates in Ghost Town, passes the Wilderness area, then passes between the the fence running along Western Avenue, makes a right turn to go along La Palma Blvd., turns right again at Fiesta Village, and back to the station in Ghost Town. There are crossings at Calico Square next to the depot, at Western between Wilderness and what used to be the Roaring 20's area--forget the name now--and another crossing at Fiesta Village.

[GRUMPY PIRATE]

The western town area you refer to is Ghost Town, the original part of the park. One-fourth of the old buildings are genuine, and came from the town of Calico, in San Bernardino County near Barstow. The train, the Calico Railroad, is a genuine 1881 Baldwin Consolidation C-19 2-8-0 narrow gauge train, originally from the Denver and Rio Grande Railroad in Colorado. It doesn't exactly go around the whole park, but it originates in Ghost Town, passes the Wilderness area, then passes between the the fence running along Western Avenue, makes a right turn to go along La Palma Blvd., turns right again at Fiesta Village, and back to the station in Ghost Town. There are crossings at Calico Square next to the depot, at Western between Wilderness and what used to be the Roaring 20's area--forget the name now--and another crossing at Fiesta Village.

Jeez, they did a lot of work, bringing the buildings and stuff to knotts!!!

wonder if Disney will keep them when they take over! (hehehehe)

Its too bad, as another poster on SGT is talking about how the park has problems with CM's and managers.

Thats why wene we go to DLR we like to stay on property and visit all the attractions, and the shops and restaurants at DTD and so on, (its the CM'S!!!! that make it great!)(oh, and the food)(oh, and the attractions) oh, and the merchandise....

[dazyhill]

The Roaring 20s area in Knott's Berry Farm is now called Boardwalk.

As for shopping, we are one of the very few places where one can buy Snoopy and other "Peanuts"-related products year-round. Most of it you can't get anywhere else.

[Randy B]

I'm sorry, I never meant to dis you or to doubt what you reported. I know that bad things do happen everywhere, WDW included.

However, there are a lot of Internet rumors about kid snatching at the Parks, and it's nice for me to be able to say it's never happened. I will admit that sentence probably deserves a "yet" at the end.

And should probably include a "successful" in the middle. Bru saw an unsuccessful attempt which would not be listed with the police (even if it was reported) as an abduction or kidnapping. Those only list successfully completed acts.

Actually the lack of successful abductions should be attributed to the excellent CMs and watchful Security CMs who prevent a successful attempt and contribute to the overall security we all feel. Of course this does not mean that we, the guests, should leave all our security to the CMs. But when you add the CMs to our own personal efforts the result is no successful abductions at WDW.

Randy